Subject: Our phone conversation a few minutes ago.
Date: Sep 24, 2010
Kam, I just got off the phone with you. We discussed me being a reference for your student loan. We also talked about the necessity of cause and effect being portrayed by your movie or written into the storyline, because such is a requirement so that the viewer/reader can follow what is happening and make sense of the movie/writings. However, the cause effect relationship isn’t required to be based on reality. (Imagine the tactics of Advertising and Public Relations for instance.) But, a movie which doesn’t have a cause and effect base on reality can pervert a person’s perception. One example is the movie you directed me to titled, “Try.”
In the movie “Try” an early childhood experience is implied by the portrayal as leading the girl to do drugs. However, in reality, many people who have no such experience turn to drugs. Also, many people who DO have such early childhood experiences grow-up to be Miss America or America’s wealthiest woman or et cetera. Thus the causal relationship as portrayed is based on illusion/delusion.
Think of it this way: an early childhood experience of a human is equivalent in effect as it is for a chimpanzee. Any difference you see would not be based on the actual experience but based on how others react to the experience, and/or how the child had been trained to react to the experience.
In a recent reply to a comment on my channel I talked about causality a little. In case you are interested, below is a copy and paste of the comments.
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@Gilmaris, you are so very right! Basically free will is commonly redefined to mean choice behavior. When I point out that my dogs can choose which trail to run down or which food out of 3 bowls to choose, they reply with, “Yeah, but dogs don’t have free will.” WTF?
Magic is usually implied with the usage. The notion of “Eve” eating an apple–giving all “her” decedents supernatural knowledge of “right” and “wrong”–has evidently been very effective at keeping the illusion of free will alive.
Literature has to be written from a causal perspective–even if the cause and effect are supernatural–or else the reader will be unable to follow the storyline. The writings will make no sense. We think in terms of cause and effect. The notion of free will contradicts the rule. Jeff Bridges’ Oscar acceptance speech reflected on the causal forces that resulted in him winning the Oscar. His speech was condemned as being simplistic. The upholders of the Status Quo don’t like such ideas advanced.
Tom Clark of Naturalism Org once notified me that causality was represented in the movie, Matrix II: Reloaded. He was excited about causality finally being given time and space by the Major Media. But after I saw the villainous character who presented the idea and the portrayal in which the idea was presented, I realize TC’s hopes had blinded him to the obvious negative effect of the portrayal. Dr JM Elliot (Playboy, 1989) interviewed someone who talked about causality: Willy Horton. (Bad publicity for causality.)
@Gilmaris, I noticed lestrangemadame suggested the possibility of deterministic inevitability or predestination. However, supposing random events are happening at the quantum level as theorized, and taking into the consideration the Butterfly Effect of Chaos Theory, then no physical system in the universe could be inevitably determined nor predestined. The randomness would become part of causality and thus make such inevitability and predestination null and void. Think about it.
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I hope you bear these facts in mind for future reference.
Subject: Clarification of my PM sent yesterday
Date: Sep 25, 2010
Kam, in my PM yesterday I said, “In the movie ‘Try’ an early childhood experience is implied by the portrayal as leading the girl to do drugs.” What is should have said is “In the movie ‘Try’ an early childhood experience can be logically deduced by the portrayal as leading the girl to do drugs.” Or better yet, maybe I should have said, “The Movie ‘Try’ likely would leave the viewer (as a result of the movie’s imagery and dialogue) with the impression that a specific early childhood experience resulted in the main female character becoming a drug addict.”
Now bear in mind, popular myths can and do have a powerful effect enhancing cognitive biases. (You can read more about cognitive bias here:
Personal experience of a human is the moment-to-moment experience and sensory awareness of internal and external events. An early belief of some philosophers of Ancient Greece was that the mind was like a recording device and simply kept somehow-objective records of what the senses experienced. This was believed in the Western world into the 20th century until modern psychological experiments decisively proved that it was not true, and that many events were simply filled in by the mind, based on what “should be,” (based on presumptions resulting from previous personal learning experiences and mental development). This, among other things, explained why eyewitness accounts of events often were so widely varied.
Also bear in mind that such movies as “Try” are a personal experience that is absorbed to a degree by unconscious processes of the mind. Remember, certain elements of the movie (both consciously and subconsciously) influence the way you perceive reality and think about things. For that reason I look upon the movie, “Try” as a deceitful piece of shit that I wouldn’t recommend to anyone, unless it happens to be an intelligent person who was interested in movies that may effectively deceive viewers.
Don’t forget that Oprah claimed such experiences during childhood but she turned out to be the most enterprising and wealthy woman in the US. Some “Miss Americas” made the same claim. In fact, few women didn’t make such claims back when it was the popular thing to do.
A female serial killer in Florida (killed truck drivers) once used the abuse excuse in an attempt to escape the death penalty.
Where is the relative causal chain when comparing the cause and effect as portrayed by the movie “Try” in comparison to the the cause and effect that resulted in Oprah, Miss America, and other “abused” celebrities?
In order to determine causal relationships in reality a method called methodological naturalism is used. Another term you may be more familiar with and which means the same thing is “the scientific method.” The scientific method uses double-blind studies. (See:
For more about personal experience and biases watch, “Looking for Truth in Personal Experience”